By David D’Alessandro
NJ.com
Oct. 28, 2024

Eleven months before the 2016 election, former Gov. Christie Whitman rang a national alarm bell about Donald Trump, referring to him in a Politico essay as a “bombastic fascist” whose “hateful rhetoric and exploitation of insecurities” evoked that of Hitler’s rise to power in Germany.

Years later, her warning has become political dogma — not only for Democrats, but for traditional Republicans like Whitman herself and former members of Trump’s administration whose own fears have dominated the news in recent weeks. The Republican party she grew up in, Whitman asserts, believed in the rule of law and the peaceful transfer of power. It denounced misogyny and racism. It did not base entire presidential campaigns on dark threats, cruelty, and demented disquisitions. It did not swear allegiance to a cultish leader.

These are the reasons why Whitman, 78, left the GOP in 2022, teaming up with former Democrat Andrew Yang to launch the Forward Party, which has 120 candidates running for state and local offices around the country this year.

She has also become an enthusiastic supporter of Kamala Harris for president, and with the campaign entering its final furlong, it is time to check in again with New Jersey’s former governor. We spoke Thursday afternoon.

Q. You were among the first Republicans to warn of Trump’s threat to democracy. Now almost every day we hear another person from the party echoing your thoughts from nine years ago. How much influence do you think it has on voters?

A. Probably not much. Not on Trump voters, anyway. I think there are many Republicans who are uncomfortable with crossing over — they bought into the first term, they never voted for a Democrat, and that remains a hurdle for them. Never mind that our democracy is at stake, and it doesn’t seem to matter that Trump is saying off-the-wall things every day. You would hope that people are listening and starting to think, “We’ve got to go in a different direction.”

Q. Still, this crescendo of anti-Trump sentiment seems to be a compelling closing argument among high-profile Republicans who have embraced your point of view. What was your reaction to John Kelly’s remarks in The Atlantic and New York Times last week about Trump’s fascism and need for Nazi general-like loyalty?

A. Well, if people don’t pay attention to the four-star general that’s put his life on the line for the country and who has lost his son for the country, I don’t know what’s going to get their attention. That makes three major figures from the military (Kelly, Jim Mattis, Mark Milley) that have served with Donald Trump, who saw him up close, and are sounding the same warning.

I just wish all of them said it sooner. I wish people like Mitt Romney would come out and just say it: This guy is unfit for office. Republicans used to be all about the rule of law; we were all about upholding the Constitution. Those were our values. But we seem to have left that behind, because of one person who has created a cult around himself.

Q. What about other high-profile Republicans: Are you surprised that Governor Christie hasn’t specified how he’s going to vote in this cycle?

A. I’m disappointed with that. I mean, come on, he’s not going to get a position in the Trump Administration. That’s not going to happen. One way or the other, I wish he would just say it. It would send a strong message to people in New Jersey, certainly.

Q. Other moderate Republicans have rationalized his Hitler-curious remarks: Chris Sununu was asked whether Trump’s German general remarks change the way he feels about Trump, and he replied, “No, we heard a lot of extreme things from Trump. It’s unfortunate, but with a guy like that it’s kind of baked into the vote.” That would seem to suggest. . . .

A. Right — that fascism is an acceptable thing. That’s mind-boggling to me. These people should know better. It makes you ask why one would want to live in a country that would actually re-elect this guy. What’s wrong with us? So many people fought and died for our democracy, and now we are giving it away with both hands, to a cult leader who is clearly not capable.

So there’s no satisfaction from what I said so long ago. I wish that it had an impact, but it clearly didn’t. And that’s frustrating. Probably only half the voters know what a fascist is. But they certainly should know what Hitler is, and they certainly should know what Trump means when he says that he is going to do what he wants. When he says, “I want generals who will support me and listen to me,” that should be a red flag for anyone.

Remember that famous poem, First They Came, by the German cleric — “First they came for the Communist, and I did not speak out…” You say, I’m not one of them, I’m not an immigrant, I’m not Jewish, I’m not a woman. I fear that’s where we are heading, and that’s one of the most unfortunate aspects to this. Some of the pushback against Kamala is that there are people who say, “I just can’t vote for a woman – I don’t think she’d be strong enough.” I don’t know how she can demonstrate anymore how strong she is. She was a strong prosecutor, she took on tough cases. She has been strong at every stage of her career.

Q. It sounds like it’s been easy for you to overlook any policy differences you have with her.

A. I met her last week for the first time last week in Pennsylvania, and I was really impressed. I mean, I already liked her, and it’s about time we had a woman as president. But I was impressed with how genuine she is, how upbeat she is about the country. I just hope that in the end, voters see that. This morning I heard someone on the radio say, “I want someone who’s upbeat and loves the country, someone who’s going to protect it and uphold the rule of law –- and that’s why I’m voting for Donald Trump.” And you have to ask these people, “Where have you been? What have you been listening to?”

Q. Is that amnesia? Cultish devotion?

A. Probably both. Since Trump entered politics, he had a dark and dystopian vision of a country that I do not recognize. And now he’s telling us exactly what he’s going to do. You know, when Hitler wrote Mein Kampf, everybody dismissed it as nonsense. Guess what, he did everything he said he would. Project 2025 has the same warnings: Trump can’t separate himself from the policies that appear in there, when it comes to dismantling the government, mass deportation and further restrictions on abortion. JD Vance can’t separate himself from writing the foreword to the book by the Project 2025 author. Just try to fathom what kind of people Trump would place in his cabinet.

It’s just so dangerous. Think of what Trump did after Helene and Milton – creating a fear that if you sought aid from FEMA, you’d get your land taken away – that hurt people, and it served to undermine people’s confidence in the federal government being able to do anything. So if they get into office – God help us – JD Vance is going to systematically dismantle government. And I ask people this: Do you really want someone with no government background — just a political agenda — deciding what’s safe for you to breathe, what’s OK to put in the water?

Q. You’ve had a long time to ponder the future of the Republican Party, which you and your family had helped shape for nearly a century. What does its future look like, and how will this election determine the direction it goes in?

A. If Trump wins, they’ll probably still call it a Republican Party, but it will just be about Trump, followed by JD Vance and probably Donald Trump Jr. But it will continue to be a cult. And if they lose this election, I think it becomes a third party.

Q. So its membership will walk away, as you did, and it is destined to be a minority party?

A. I think so, if he loses. When you look at our party, The Forward Party, the largest group of registrants are the unaffiliated, Republicans are 25%, and Democrats are 24%. And I believe we’re the only ones that can make a difference. Until then, what I hope happens in this election cycle is that people are just afraid to say that they are for Kamala Harris, but when they pull the lever, they’ll do what I consider the right thing